Islam the new Communism
Watching a documentary about the Rosenberg’s I was taken with the similarities to today. I can’t help but wonder whether in fifty years time society will equate the treatment prisoners in Guantanamo with the trial of the Rosenberg’s, the Japanese internment camps or even the Salem witch trails. It seems that Islamic loyalists share a similar burden to the Americans that agreed with communist philosophy, up until its alleged fall during the Reagan years. I say alleged because Hugo Chavez, Fidel Castro and more than a billion Chinese seem to be keeping that dream alive.
I’m not making excuses for terrorists’ hell bent on killing innocent people but I’m going to go out on a limb and say there are most likely prisoners of war and acquaintances of people of interest who have been held in prison for almost 4 years that shouldn’t have been. Now and again I think of these people and the government’s insistence that their incarceration makes us safer and I wonder whether that is really true.
I’m not making excuses for terrorists’ hell bent on killing innocent people but I’m going to go out on a limb and say there are most likely prisoners of war and acquaintances of people of interest who have been held in prison for almost 4 years that shouldn’t have been. Now and again I think of these people and the government’s insistence that their incarceration makes us safer and I wonder whether that is really true.
posted by mochi at 8:32 PM
12 Comments:
Mochi,
Islam has lasted for centuries and has played itself out the same countless times in history. What is going on now is nothing new.
I understand what you are saying about Guantanamo, and I don't think that anyone in the United States would want to hold innocent people. The problem is, Mochi, is that many there are not innocent, and the intelligence they have provided could have possibly saved millions.
What happens at Gitmo is nothing different than what happens around the world and even in our own prison system. Any time someone is in the wrong place at the wrong time, they run the risk of such. How many cases have there been where people have been convicted wrongly of a crime and spent years in prison because of it. When this happens do we shut down the prisons, discontinue the justice system, let every criminal go free because of the exceptions.
I think it is unfair that any innocent be incarcerated, but it is an unfortunate by-product of a far from perfect system. Realistically, what do you think we could do to make it better?
-Jack
We tend not to incarcerate the innocent because of that little thing called a trial. Something these people haven't had. I think we could give them the same legal protections we give our citizens.
"Realistically, what do you think we could do to make it better?"
Realistically, we could not imprison innocent people. We could also, maybe, release innocent prisoners as soon as we know that they are innocent. Is that so crazy?
The U.S. admits it has imprisoned innocent people. If they know they're innocent, they should not imprison them! It's immoral and unethical, and it should not be tolerated just because it's "hard work" doing the right thing. There are reports of children being imprisoned by us..! Is that the moral standard we want to be associated with?
I know, Shea. I agree. Do we know that we are not releasing the ones who we know are innocent? I'm not tremendously in favor of our court system trying these people because it is ill-equipped to do so. A military tribunal possibly--or even a world court. Our Constitution and its law does not apply to foreign terrorist, and this is new territory even for the world. The U.N. (mostly) is not crying for thier release, because they are even befuddled about what to do with the situation.
I agree that innocent people should not be held, and every effort should be made to determine who is and who isn't.
-Jack
It seems like no information has been disclosed about who these prisoners are, where they are from, what they know and what they have disclosed to us. All we ever get from Gitmo is the politically driven debate of the potential mistreatment of prisoners, nothing specific about who they are or anything like that. Maybe I am missing out and have just not noticed it, you guys can help me here. Has there been any information disclosed on the identities of who is being held there at least? Is this just a U.S. operation, or might we perhaps have the cooperation of some other countries in how we apprehend and interrogate? I feel that part of the outrage of Gitmo from the American people stems from a lack of information as to what specifically goes on there and who is being held, etc. If we had more specific information and the people knew more, it would clear some things up. At the same time, perhaps it is a national security issue and they do not disclose such info for that reason...
Shea, that opinion piece is three years old. Every detainee at Gitmo has had a tribunal in which they can dispute their guilt. Source.
Of course, its a briefing from Satan's right hand man - Rumsfeld. So how much truth can there be in it? I mean, considering the amount of scrutiny given Gitmo in recent years, he can lie all he wants without fear that someone - anyone! - will verify his statements.
Oh yeah. Some of those "innocents" that were released? They were caught - again - fighting U.S. troops. Kind of calls their "innocence" into question.
Pretty powerful arguments, Sean & CH. Does it really come down to a political debate vs. a truly humanitarian one?
I wonder...
-Jack
Actually, the quotes I was referencing are:
"USA Today quoted a secret Pakistani intelligence report as saying that 'US authorities have agreed that most of the Pakistanis are innocent and they were at the wrong place at the wrong time...'"
"Kuwaiti officials say that at least nine of 12 Kuwaitis held in Guantanamo are innocent."
Time does not wash away what happened.
If this is the case, Shea, then those people should have been set free. Have they been?
-Jack
I did a quick Google and couldn't find that reference. Do you have a link Shea?
Aside from the link in the earlier comment, I just Google for it, too. I am in the process of organizing about a bazillion or more links I've saved and I probably have one there... somewhere...
Okay, but that earlier link was the problem. It's old and doesn't support your current claims.
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